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thus spoke zarathustra best translation reddit

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thus spoke zarathustra best translation reddit

New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast, More posts from the askphilosophy community. All the translators add their own character to the work though, and I don't think you'll find too much of a consensus on the 'best' version. This is a moderated subreddit. In 1909, Thomas Common translated it as "Superman", following the terminology of George Bernard Shaw's 1903 stage play Man and Superman. I always had all 3 books open when reading. It includes the German philosopher’s famous discussion of the phrase ‘God is dead’ as well as his concept of the Superman. However, I was able to get a much more comprehensive understanding of what he was saying in zarathustra by the following method: I had the kaufmann translation + I went to the library and got more commentaries than I needed that do a play by play of the book. ... Line-by-line modern translations of every Shakespeare play and poem. I find nietzsche quite difficult to understand for a number of reasons, one is that he makes many obscure references. Reading two translations is going to give you a better sense of the text than any one will. Thus Spoke Zarathustra: A Book for All and None is a philosophical novel by German philosopher Friedrich Nietzsche, composed in four parts written and published between 1883 and 1885. Whoever reads his post-humously published writings for the years 1869-82 with care, will constantly meet with passages suggestive of Zarathustra’s thoughts and doctrines. While there are plenty of stylistic parallels between Zarathustra and certain religious texts, Common's reads too biblically (intentionally so too, he used the King James Bible as a reference). This abridged version, however, concludes after the climax of the book, The Seven Seals, and does not continue into the fourth and final part of Nietzsche's most iconic work. ... “This is absolutely THE best teacher resource I have ever purchased. Thus Spoke Zarathustra Term Analysis | LitCharts. Both are very anti-establishment. "Thus Spoke Zarathustra" is a 19th century literary masterpiece and key philosophical work by Nietzsche. Thus Spoke Zarathustra (A Modernized Translation with a New Introduction and Biography) - Kindle edition by Nietzsche, Friedrich, Bill Chapko, Thomas Common. Thus spoke Zarathustra also contains the famous dictum “God is dead“. There are many books with several different translations, and the only place I've ever really found any information has been searching through Amazon reviews. Another major help is having some understanding of Jung's theories. So, after a vote held, it was decided that r/philosophybookclub will be reading Thus Spoke Zarathustra this Fall! I'm looking for a good translation of Thus Spoke Zarathustra for self-guided learning, something with extensive explanations and footnotes, or perhaps a separate companion book. Clearly the Kaufmann translation is favored by a lot of people, but can you recommend a good commentary for companion reading? Kaufmann's version, which has become the most widely available, features a translator's note suggesting that Nietzsche's text would have benefited from an editor; Martin suggests that Kaufmann "took it upon himself to become his [Nietzsche's] editor". Originally Answered: What is the best translation of Thus Spoke Zarathustra? And though I know Kaufmann is out of fashion, if you're pursuing Nietzsche for non-academic, personal purposes, he's the only way to go. Thus Spoke Zarathustra: A Book for All and None (German: Also sprach Zarathustra: Ein Buch für Alle und Keinen, also translated as Thus Spake Zarathustra) is a philosophical novel by German philosopher Friedrich Nietzsche, composed in four parts written and published between 1883 and 1885. I can't claim to have a good handle on what nietzsche is saying - but who really can? The first discussion post will go up Monday, Septermber 5th, and another post will appear every Monday (until we finish). I know people say you need background knowledge. I would avoid Common's translation though. Best is to read Amazon reviews - keep your salt shaker nearby - along with critical reviews. LitCharts assigns a color and icon to each theme in Thus Spoke Zarathustra, which you can use to track the themes throughout the work. I've been interested in this book for some time, but it's my understanding that it's a bit of a hard read outside of a guided classroom setting. Thus Spoke Zarathustra will be incredibly obscure if it's your first Nietzsche book, you should ideally have read the following beforehand in order to better understand the work: Failing the above, Twilight of the Idols is a fairly short compression of much of Nietzsche's thought, and I'd highly recommend giving it a go before trying TSZ. If you're looking for help with a personal book recommendation, consult our Weekly Recommendation Thread, Suggested Reading page, or ask in r/suggestmeabook. Thus Spoke Zarathustra ... “This is absolutely THE best teacher resource I have ever purchased. Specifically, I'm looking for something on existentialism and maybe postmodernism. Jennings does a great job narrating Thus Spoke Zarathustra. Kaufmann's the academic standard in the US, I believe. Composed in four parts between 1883 and 1885, Thus Spoke Zarathustra is the most famous and influential work of German philosopher Friedrich Nietzsche. Thus Spoke Zarathustra Of the Afterworldsmen Summary & Analysis | LitCharts. Thus Spoke Zarathustra: A Book for All and None is a philosophical novel by German philosopher Friedrich Nietzsche, composed in four parts written and published between 1883 and 1885. The Cambridge UP text (del Caro's translation) is just a hideously bound edition. This edition is printed on premium acid-free paper, is translated by Thomas Common, includes introductions by Willard Huntington Wright and Elizabeth Forster-Nietzsche, and notes by Anthony M. Ludovici. But that won't work with TSZ. You do. Kaufmann should suit your purposes fine. In English. Much of the work deals with ideas such as the "eternal recurrence of the same," the parable on the "death of God," and the "prophecy" of the Übermensch, which were first introduced in The Gay Science. Thus Spoke Zarathustra will be incredibly obscure if it's your first Nietzsche book, you should ideally have read the following beforehand in order to better understand the work:. I've been trying to find the solution to this for a while. But if later or earlier philosophers explore the concept in a better way, please enlighten me. For instance, the ideal of the Superman is put forth quite clearly in all his I have the Adrian del Caro translation as well, and I end up referencing both fairly often. It feels plotless, preachy and bloated with unnecessary metaphor. Does anyone here own the Martin translation? I self learned the first section/book? It has been noted for being faithful to Nietzsche’s writing and for overall staying true to the text by best representing the nuances and the language. But you will still be inspired or shocked or something, because the writing itself is passionate and powerful. I think I may have had 4 or 5 commentaries. As with any of Nietzsche's writing, I would recommend the Walter Kaufmann translation. Nietzsche was influenced by Arthur Schopenhauer’s The World as Will and Representation (1818), reacting against the pessimism of this book in Thus Spoke Zarathustra.He also draws on ideas from Charles Darwin’s On the Origin of Species (1859) in his musings about human origins and ongoing evolution. It is very easy to understand and the cadence of his speech is perfect and evocative for total comprehension. “This is absolutely THE best teacher resource I have ever purchased. Parkes' translation was the most enjoyable to read IMHO. I'm only drawn to Nietzsche because of the "God is Dead" concept, ie. Well Kaufmann's is the academic standard, for better or worse. By using our Services or clicking I agree, you agree to our use of cookies. The book is a dense and esoteric treatise on philosophy and philosophy, featuring as a fictionalized prophet descending from his recluse to mankind, Zarathustra. Thus Spoke Zarathustra (hereafter TSZ) is a difficult book to translate. I had also got a fair bit (for a n00b) of psychoanalysis readings under my belt as well. The composer conducted its first performance on 27 November 1896 in Frankfurt Zarathustra descends from his cave in the mountains after ten years of solitude, brimming with wisdom and love and wants to teach humanity. Much of the work deals with ideas such as the "eternal recurrence of the same," the parable on the "death of God," and the "prophecy" of the Übermensch, which were first introduced in The Gay Science. The Cambridge UP text (del Caro's translation) is just a hideously bound edition. Beyond Good and Evil. I personally favor Kaufmans translations. A bit off-topic, but is there a resource for translation questions like this? I have covered this in a philosophy of culture class and I didn't like it all in the sense that I would use the words of Descartes when he criticized branches of philosophy as building sandcastles. Open menu. It's what I own and it seems good. I own the Martin one and it seems accurate stylistically, but I'm not so sure about content-wise. When I wanted to buy this book, I spoke to several philosophy teachers at my college that were knowledgeable about Nietzsche and they said that the Kaufmann translation is the best. The Birth of Tragedy. While I still find his philosphy very interesting, I have learned much more that answered my questions in non-academic/western philosophy. While there are plenty of stylistic parallels between Zarathustra and certain religious texts, Common's reads too biblically (intentionally so too, he used the King James Bible as a reference). If you've read Hegel but no Schopenhauer and have at least a Stanford Encyclopedia article of background in Nietzsche do you think that you can understand Thus Spoke Zarathustra?Currently I'm going through a reading list in chronological order and Thus Spoke Zarathustra is right after Phenomenology of Spirit, Capital, and On Liberty which are going to be all I have post-Kant before … As thought-provoking as ever, “Thus Spoke Zarathustra” remains as one of the most unique philosophical works ever written. I read a bit of the primary text then perused all my commentary books. And translator's prefaces can be informative. How's your Kant, Schopenhauer, and Hegel? I'd advise you to instead read something about philosophy of culture where it is pretty much guaranteed Nietzsche will be treated. This helped me penetrate through a lot of the cloudiness in nietzsche. For each quote, you can also see the other characters and themes related to it (each theme is indicated by its own dot and icon, like this one: ). I'm not sure about Martin though because it's a Barnes & Noble Classics edition, and they generally tend to use horrible translations for them. Thus Spoke Zarathustra Introduction + Context. It depends heavily on which translation you’re using. If you're able, get different translations from your library and do a quick comparison. I have a budding interest in philosophy, but I'm on the easily distractable side and god, is it boring me. of thus spoke zarathustra - this was the deepest nietzsche learning I have done. I ended up with the following setup: Primary text + commentary book that generally explained obscure references and what he is saying on a shallow level + commentary book that had a deeper level and also helped in general understanding. Furthermore, and this is perhaps the best advice I can give, I had listened to alan watts lectures and general readings about buddhism. I think osho may be a nice alternative to reading nietzsche. The book is considered among his most well-known and important works. Kaufmann's abilities as a poetic translator really come to the fore. As with any Nietzsche text, the text itself is intended to be interpreted and is intentionally impossible to parse and understand via rational inquiries and objectivity. Yeah I kind of figured that. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. Press J to jump to the feed. It also helped with hegel! I've just picked up "Thus Spoke Zarathustra" and it honestly feels like I'm trying to read the bible cover-to-cover. Only problem is you walk away with the wrong ideas in your head --ideas that Nietzsche was not promoting. I actually prefer his translation of TSZ to a lot of the more modern ones. Also sprach Zarathustra, Op. It was not a tough decision for translators once I started reading Nietzsche. Thus Spake Zarathustra conceptions of my brother’s mind. Thus Spoke Zarathustra will be incredibly obscure if it's your first Nietzsche book, you should ideally have read the following beforehand in order to better understand the work:. My interest is personal rather than academic. Friedrich Nietzsche's most accessible and influential philosophical work, misquoted, misrepresented, brilliantly original and enormously influential, Thus Spoke Zarathustrais translated from the German by R.J. Hollingdale in Penguin Classics. Also, the Kaufmann translation is available in many different bindings so you have variety on your side too. Thus Spoke Zarathustra. Would I be better served by Kierkegaard? Finally, companion books. Here are the major ones (with their translation of Übermensch listed next to them): I doubt anyone on here has read all of them, but which is supposed to be the best? My main beef with Kaufmann is that he changes a lot of the grammar and stylistic elements. Cookies help us deliver our Services. ... Line-by-line modern translations of every Shakespeare play and poem. Thus spoke Zarathustra is the classic full-text work by Friedrich Nietzsche. the loss of purpose and moral direction in society due to the lessened relevance of religion to modern everyday life. It is our intent and purpose to foster and encourage in-depth discussion about all things related to books, authors, genres, or publishing in a safe, supportive environment. Parkes' translation was the most enjoyable to read IMHO; wish it had been out when I was a student. I would avoid Common's translation though. With a traditional philosophical text the translator's conscience is driven by accuracy, and when in doubt the translator will be as literal as possible. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. Studying eastern & western religions, mysticism, theology, and psychoanalysis...requires much less mental gymnastics to arrive at a similar cloudy point as nietzsche, schopenauer and the like may lead you to if you are mentally fit enough to make it there. So I'm a bit suspicious about its accuracy. Hi Reddit. In any case, the translation(s) will be different. /r/askphilosophy aims to provide serious, well-researched answers to philosophical questions. Through reading the commentaries I found the best books, and chucked the ones I didnt like/weren't helpful. Again, most people who have read the text did so with the Kaufmann translation. I've heard that the Martin version isn't too shabby, and I do like the fact that he leaves Übermensch untranslated, so if I were you I'd go with either the Kaufmann or the Hollingdale translations and just read them alongside Martin's. 2005, page xxxiii. This is my concern with Nietzsche, he makes a lot of criticisms of non-famous people long dead that aren't going to be understood by the average reader. Hollingdale, via Penguin Classics, is also great, and has helpful footnotes. In 1896, Alexander Tille made the first English translation of Thus Spoke Zarathustra, rendering Übermensch as "Beyond-Man". 30 (German: [ˈalzo ʃpʁaːx t͡saʁaˈtʊstʁa] (), Thus Spoke Zarathustra or Thus Spake Zarathustra) is a tone poem by Richard Strauss, composed in 1896 and inspired by Friedrich Nietzsche's philosophical 1883-1885 novel Thus Spoke Zarathustra. Thus Spoke Zarathustra: A Book for All and None First Part Zarathustra’s Prologue The Speeches of Zarathustra On the Three Metamorphoses On the Teachers of Virtue On the Hinterworldly On the Despisers of the Body On the Passions of Pleasure and Pain On the Pale Criminal On Reading and Writing The Thus Spoke Zarathustra quotes below all refer to the symbol of Sun, Noon, Noontide. I did have some minimal nietzsche under my belt, but it was really really superficial. Nonexistent. Those that do argue with others that say they do also! Genealogy of Morals. Sometimes readability is what matters. Jung actually did a huge ass seminar on thus spoke zarathustra that I would love to check it out and is probably really cool. It's where Kaufmann's abilities as a poetic translator really come to the fore. I feel he also fails to convey the meaning of much of the German. It seems to read VERY much like the Bible. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. I first came across Kaufmann for his translation of von Goethe's Faust, and was blown away. Thus Spoke Zarathustra is a foundational work of Western literature and is widely considered to be Friedrich Nietzsche’s masterpiece. Press J to jump to the feed. The work is a philosophical novel in which the character of Zarathustra, a religious prophet-like figure, delivers a series of lessons and sermons in a Biblical style that articulate the central ideas of Nietzsche's mature thought. I second reading multiple translations, as well as avoiding Common's. I'd say they're both pretty much on par in terms of style and content, although if forced to choose I'd opt for the Kaufmann. Edit: Beyond Nietzsche, I'd recommend poking your head inside some Schopenhauer--ideally, again, the World as Will & Idea-- but if you want to get straight to Freddy, go for some of his essays (all readily available online), particularly On the Suffering of the World, which boils down many of the elements in his thought that Nietzsche adopted and reacted to (will to life, pessimism, asceticism). He understands Nietzsche very well and is ingenious at coming up with ways of translating Nietzsche's jokes, plays on words, rhymes, and meaning into English in sometimes uncanny ways.

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